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Workchoices under fire

by Tony Phillips

The biggest rally in Melbourne since last November, against the attacks on working conditions and pay rates in John Howard's "Workchoices" legislation, took place yesterday morning. While the turnout was short of the mammoth 170,000 plus that turned up last time, a fair estimate would put the crowd well within the 100,000 range.

This time the march did not take a linear route, rather protesters converged on the commercial centre of the Bourke St Mall from four directions. This made a crowd estimate more difficult to take, but some quick cuts between blocks by your humble reporter, and taking note of radio reports from other locations, plus a good view of the throng from the top of Swanston St (it reached Flinders St in the south) makes a guesstimate of 100,000 plus one that can be made with confidence. The size of the crowd meant the mall filled quickly and the marchers became a rally that formed a cross for three or four city blocks deep around it.

This rally was much more obviously a union one, with union flags, banners and blue overalls dominating the scene. This, coupled with reports from union leaders that public transport was currently effectively free, since ticket inspectors had joined the rally, gave the whole thing a festive, St Petersburg in February 1917 air. Given how far John Howard is winding back liberal democracy this is not as incongruous as it seems at first. The ancien regime and the workhouse no longer seem as distant as they should.

Less young people were in evidence (on the North-South axis at least) than at the previous rally, but this could partly be because of the school and university holidays. School uniforms were understandably nowhere to be seen this time. The crowd was good humoured; though there was an edge of grimness as speakers who had already suffered dismissal, or odious changes to working conditions, spoke of their experience. Not surprisingly concerns about sudden sackings and their effects on security and family life, and the reduction/removal of penalty rates, dominated both formal speeches and comments in the crowd.

Kim Beazley again spoke well, actually producing some passion to go with tailored for soundbite phrases he necessarily uttered. Bolstered by recent reports, such as that of the OECD, that show there is little economics to the changes, leaving lots of politics and ideology as the main cause, he had earlier indulged in a ding dong battle with right wing pundit and Liberal loyalist Neil Mitchell on tabloid talkback station 3AW. Taken on Mitchell retreated somewhat, more or less falling back on the old right wing standby of distinguishing between "ordinary workers" (god love‚em) and "union thugs" (a jihad upon them).  The myth that unions are actually some sort of evil external imposition is always an at least implied assumption in right wing rhetoric.

One problem with these rallies is how they end. Unfortunately the degree to which unions are infused with apparatchiks means that speeches are too many and go on too long, moreover imagination about how a more two way interaction with the marchers could take place is lacking. Given that one of the speakers, introduced right at the end when many at the rear of the march were leaving, was the grand-daughter of one of the makers of the Eureka flag, surely this was an opportunity for an oath of disobedience and resistance to be sworn.

Whatever else, the size of the attendance shows the union movement can still mobilise civil society, and that concerns about the lack of workchoices and punitive approach the federal government is pursuing continue to have powerful resonance. Howard and his munchkin minister Andrews must continue to count on the fact that these changes are most likely to only hurt those on lower incomes who mostly vote Labor anyway. Society is certainly being divided by the Liberal foray into class war, and who will ultimately have the numbers is something for which will have to wait and see. But for now at least the unions have shown they can effectively fill the streets with "ordinary Australians".

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The removal of the foundations of democracy.

I have believed for a long time that the hopes of the less rich and less military nations of this world of ours, only have one chance of survival - the United Nations.

Apparently to appease the most powerful of those Nations - the Charter provides for a euphemistic "Security Council" and their power of veto.

Surely this is attributed to the dictate that the "bullies" of this world have the final say.

Logically, this means that the involvement of the most backward and impoverished countries is a patronising method of hoping that they will allow any decision of the Council gives them the "right of entry".

And yet - like the "League of Nations" corrupted by the United States of America (where Woodrow Wilson was accused of thinking that he was Jesus Christ)  and the current United Nations Charter, were and are genuine efforts to stabilise this world before the Military/Corporate destroys it.

The Corporations' attitude of "if it ain't broke - don't fix it" is, in my experience, one of the most accepted stupid Corporate adages I have ever heard. Surely the importance of intelligence is maintenance - then it SHOULD NOT BE BROKE.

Apply those diametrically opposed principles to Howard's U.S. directed claim for Nuclear Reactors.  Isn't that just  "jumping from the frying pan into the fire" - "correcting a minor problem by replacing it with a major one"?

But, let us wait until the Bush regime and Karl Rove decides the weakness in our chain of dissent - and exploits it.

I still believe that even the right wing Fairfax media of my parent's respect, should survive - if only for the "inconvenient truths" of their still available journalist's Charter of independence.

There is no truth - only the powers that be. 

What will be the Howard Corporate lie this time?

A "Never ever G.S.T."?

A disgraceful breach of Maritime Law with the "TAMPA"?

Another ignored drowning of desperate people in the SIEV X?

A contrived lie by Howard's Mate Peter Reith about "babies overboard? For which he was rewarded?

A flag waving "WE will decide who will come to this country...."?  (Terrorists too?)

In 2004 it was the Bush Administration telling our people, through the Corporate Media, that we MUST vote for the Liberals or they may not protect us from "terrorism".

Mark Latham dared to say: "How does Howard get away with it"?

During the "Longest Decade" of trashing the values of a wonderful country, the "New Order" Liberals have been able to "get away with" some of the most blatant unlawful; wasteful; dishonest; corrupt and incompetent behaviour in my lifetime of some 15 Prime Ministers.

Will it be Climate change which Howard has ignored and "rejected" for his entire time in Office?

Will it be "water shortage" which has been reliably reported as "not less rainfall but increased usage of the rivers". With a "Minister" who has been fast-tracked for what reason?

Will it be "Muslim Terrorists under the bed" while the Saudi Arabians (including Osama bin Laden) who are alleged to have perpetrated 911 - continue to be Bush's close financial suppliers?

OR  "Red ragger Communists"  (while he negotiates with China, our biggest trade partner)?

So, what will it be?

I believe that it will have already been discussed at the regular Corporation instruction meetings for Howard and his sycophants.

Is it possible that one - just one of those controllers of information - could break ranks and report facts with only editorial comment?

So far the "New Order" Liberals have not been able to close down freedom of expression in this website - as they have done all over the country. 

And yet, the Liberal drones keep saying that the loss of our privacy is alright on the basis of "if you have nothing to hide"!!!

Or the "jovial car salesman" Joe Hockey saying that "technology is the best friend of privacy"!!!  Fair dinkum.

Howard's "moving targets" continue to confuse the casual political observers among us - however, we should always attribute the lies and incompetencies of the part-time "New Order" Liberals to the entire Howard government.

Let's remove them all - vote for whoever but - not the Liberals.


Repetitive - but periodically necessary.

Vale to the Canberra Times Have Your Say - but I would like to repeat another of my observations in that forum of free speech.

"Thursday 17 June 2004. id=68828.

NOT how high? Don't jump!

I have always had the opinion that Howard is an insecure little schoolboy who took on two professions for his own protection.  Namely the law (and how to avoid it) and politics where his ambitions [and revenge - added] can be achieved without accountability.

He has for thirty, thirsty years, aligned his allegiance to the "biggest of the bunch".  That is - "heavies" like R.G. Menzies, big business and the media barons.

Control the information and you control the people.

There is no doubt that his "success" is due to that attitude and, his ability to lie and obfuscate beyond which most people could imagine."

AND:  "His methods included replacing all those who would not support his secret and unaccountable behaviour - from the cabinet, through the backbenchers to the entire public service.  In essence, ALL who might blow the whistle on him.

His dishonesty and inability to face criticism of any kind, started to surface clearly after the 2001 election.  Lie after lie was exposed due to the diligence and independence of the Senate estimates Committee (excluding Meg Lees of course)".  [ Added - Hasn't he now reduced the number of those accountable committees even though he has the majority?)

"Now, his servility to the "heavy" policies of the Bush regime has drawn him into a situation where, as always without a positive policy of his own, he has inextricably dragged our country into a quagmire of an illegal military expedition in Iraq.

A Guardian columnist, Naomi Klein, has stated viz: 'Can we please stop calling it a quagmire? The United States isn't mired in a bog in Iraq.  It is free-falling off a cliff.  The only question is: who will follow the Bush clan off this precipice, and who will refuse to jump...?

Now appears yet again, the hypocrisy of Bush and Howard.  Bush says that the trial of Saddam, will be for the Iraqis because it will be their sovereignty!  And their democracy!  Fair dinkum!!!

May I ask, what about OUR sovereignty and OUR democracy?

As I venture to suggest what the U.S. wishes they too could do, Mark Latham has offered us the opportunity to refuse to "jump completely" and we should grasp it with both hands!  Iraq needs help, Doctors and Nurses, NOT tanks and guns.

Bring our servicemen and women home! Make your vote count for THEIR pride and safety, not the Howard Government's.  Buyer beware."  End of quote.

COMMENT:  Then, misinformed and persuaded by the "pay for comment" media, (and the vilification and stalking of a good Australian) the electoral Commission declared the "New Order" Liberals again took government of this once great nation.

It is indeed a small consolation that the predictions of the "read between the lines" people have proven correct.

Please "Old Liberals", look beyond the horizons of your "pay code" electorate and, even if you still believe that this "brown nosing" of the Bush Administration is good for you - just imagine what it means to the families who Howard and Costello criticise for not having more children.

If you now realise that the "New Order" Liberals are really about removing free speech, the sharing of prosperity and the sale of everything Australian, at least donate to the Labor Party to allow them to be a viable opposition.


post-Hayekian imperfections, and other perversions

From 'Bringing up Baby': "Do what you want!" (I know you will anyway.)

Whilst attempting to 'get back up to speed' after a (mostly) relaxing few days' hols, I came upon this from Ernest William ... on September 30, 2006 - 5:34pm (On 'The longest decade: a review' thread): "I try to find truth in the claims by the Howard Liberals regarding the supposed 'prosperity' of contemporary Australia."

G'day EWG, and thanks for your gracious inference (that I might be helpful). On the one hand you are correct, of course, to be sceptical of most things 'Liberal' and especially of anything 'Howardish'. But on the other hand, I must immediately warn that (IMHO) not all things 'Labor' are necessarily 'good' - or even merely 'better'. The sad fact is (again IMHO) that both the current Lib/Lab ugly-twin 'sides' are not operating in our (we the people's) best interests - rather, they are both more or less in the complete thrall of 'the big end of town' - and any concern manifested for us is almost only to keep us quiet. However, you are also correct in your estimation of 'venal' in reference to the MSM, and when it comes to corruption, I include big bits'a the AusBC 'right' in there. It's part of the prevalent 'propaganda pushed paradigm' to accuse the AusBC of 'left-wing' bias; the truth is that the bias is there alright, but (much more usually) in the exact opposite sense, and for 'proof' look no further than RN/Breakfast.

As for current 'prosperity', it's a bit more than 'supposed' - but quite a bit less than we (rightly!) deserve, and is also partly illusory. What's largely 'keeping the lid on' is (supposedly!) 'cheap' imports; shipping industry (and jobs with it) off-shore lets us benefit from cheap(er) labour and new(er) production processes, but can come at the cost of sweat-shop conditions and increased pollution 'elsewhere,' as well as we suffering the direct loss of local industry and jobs, etc: i.e. all the 'paradoxes' of globalisation. We may not be able to stop this process, but we could/should try to make it as far as possible 'socially just.'

The 'illusory' part is that based on a) debt, b) 'hidden' costs and c) outright rip-offs (i.e. theft). As far as humongous debt goes we're not alone (see gross US 'excesses') but it has been remarked by 'some who ort'a know' that if one wanted one single action to stimulate massive house-price inflation, the halving of CGT probably could not have been excelled. The biggest single 'hidden' cost is, of course, the loading-up of our atmosphere with CO2 (Warning! Warning! - Greedastrophe® ahead!) The biggest single 'rip-off' is, of course, the 'resource-rent' theft of our sovereign property; the minerals 'flogged-off' without anywhere near adequate recompense to us, we the people.

What prosperity that we have from mining is largely - if not wholly - 'trickle-down,' especially if this story is at all indicative: Environmentalists warn against McArthur River diversion.


The McArthur River mine opened in 1995... It still contains one of the world's largest deposits of zinc and lead.

We believe having a marginal mine paying no royalty is preferable to no mine at all.

Imagine that! 'Paying no royalty!' None at all! Resource-rent rip-off here = 100%! All 'we the people' could possibly get from McArthur River/Xstrata is wages, and we the people (i.e. taxpayers) probably 'foot the bill' for some if not all mine-extraneous infrastructure. Want more? (Actually, less): "the mine enjoys a heavy subsidy from the Territory Government of some $5 million a year and rising towards its electricity costs. The subsidy will continue while the mine operates till 2015." This is one very ugly mine.


Now, Hayek. Whilst fishing around in my (paper) archive, I came upon a print of this (Warning! Warning! - Suspected right-whingers!) article, then I found another, perhaps better one nearby. The articles are called "No Third Way: Hayek and the Recovery of Freedom" and "The 'Asian Way' and Modern Liberalism: A Hayekian Perspective." (I recommend reading the articles 'with eyes wide open' with a view to identifying and discarding any and all right-whinger rubbish.)

Note: Freedom, Liberalism. Hayek is the 'guru' of 'free markets,' and some of the discussion is couched in terms of 'capitalism vs. socialism.' All well and good; the assertion that Reagan (plus Thatcher) are heroes 'belongs' here too. (The assertions over Reagan and Thatcher being utterly wrong, always IMHO of course.)

But (and it's a mighty big BUT): although 'the (democratic) West' (mainly US, some UK and Aus as 'dag' (as 'seen' from here, but EU etc as well)) has fairly-well outlasted 'the Commies,' I think it's erroneous to use 'capitalism vs. socialism;' the dominant current system is plutocratic rather than democratic, and kleptocratic rather than capitalist. It's not just a matter of terms - as some fancy dialectical dilettante (pronounced dill - err, tanty) might try to assert - but it's a matter of observation: what you see is what you get. And what you see is almost exclusively plutocratic and kleptocratic, basta!

To summarise: to be truly free we'd need a fully functioning form of democracy; that we ain't got: the Lib/Lab (over there Rep/Dem) ugly-twins offer us no choice. (To add insult to injury, the Libs are (mostly) not liberal, and the Labs are (mostly) not for labour.) And as if that'd not be enough, so-called 'representatives' cannot represent us with any sort'a meaningful fidelity. Further, to properly function, a democracy would need full and frank info; that we ain't got: the venal MSM including big bits'a the AusBC offer us not much outside'a the propaganda pushed paradigm (aka lies).

To follow Hayek, we'd need properly free markets with no hidden costs or rip-offs; that we ain't got: what we've really got is collusion, pollution (becoming deadly i.e. CO2), cartels and oligopolies when not monopolies and prices (mostly highest): 'whatever the market will bear' - and to top all that off, outright theft (i.e. resource-rents.) The assertion has also been made, that one can't legislate morality. What utter BS! (Ooops! - Always IMHO, of course.) Even blind-Freddy knows what's fair; legislators (being captives when not knaves (usually both)) just don't want.

What the illegal invasion of Iraq (murder for oil) by B, B & H showed (for those who hadn't already seen it), is that both business and politics are dominated by crooks and crime; we can easier see this now because the internet enables us to 'see through' the venal MSM. Ordinarily (perhaps, and for the proxy-murderers for sure), the crimes we are immersed in might not matter (much!) - but the criminals are 'leading' us towards the climate greedastrophe. The same internet gives us the chance to coordinate action to reverse both the crimes and the creeping greedastrophe. Let's just get on and do it. A suggestion: we could (totally!) 'bypass' the Lib/Lab ugly-twins by listing them last and 2nd last (in your own preferred order, natch) on the ballots. If 50%+1 of the voters did this we'd be guaranteed of having no Lib/Lab elected. Must be better, no?

G'day Phil.

I have seriously missed your wisdom.

I am appreciative of your constructive criticism of the big picture of our political landscape and your lack of bias.

Even with my years of "observation" I can only believe that  the advent of "socialism" will bring together the Howard wedges of the "haves and have nots".

There is no truth - only the powers that be.

The Liberal's influx of slave labour.

Before the "New Order" Liberal's officially hand over more power to the "powers that be", let's consider the effect of these 19th century Industrial laws.

I have been claiming for years that the policies of the Howard Liberals is to create a poor class of workers - "White Coolies".

Surely by now, the majority of Australians, at least those who love our country, can clearly see the U.S. crafted plans for the "Deputy Sheriff of the South Pacific"?

This is a Liberal Government which not only betrays it's own principles, but the future of Australians all.

They are now dealing with the most corrupt country in the world - India. They are giving India the personal information of every credit card holder to do with as they wish.

They are driving down our wages and conditions to accommodate the China that Howard has personally condemned for nearly thirty years.

They are bringing in Asian and Afro-Asian slave workers and watching while the de-regulated business vultures, crucify them in both pay and living conditions and sack them for considering joining a Union!

Even the most bigoted "New Order" Liberal will see this as "crushing all organised dissent" to the detriment of Liberty?

And what is the penalty for these draconian acts of bastardry? The Office of "destroying relations" will have a look at it - Fair dinkum.


Slave Workers

Ernest William, so Howard is giving India the personal information of every credit card holder to do with as they wish. Are you serious with this claim, or are you scratching around for something to say. I would suggest to you that if Greg Combet wanted my credit card details, all he would have to do is speak to one of his union members who works in one of the banks Call Centres and he would hand it over. That is assuming the banks have not got safegauards in place, which I am sure they do. I am afraid you are thrashing about in the dark a bit like Beazley at the moment.

Not the usual lie but, intended to mislead.

So the "New Order" Liberals claim that THEY have increased the wages of employees for the last decade?

Actually, they represented the interests of the corporations in the independent Industrial Commission's considerations of wage applications by the Australian Council of Trade unions.

In 2002, the ASU claim that year in the National Wage Case, coordinated by the ACTU, was for an increase of $25 per week, but a Full Bench of the Commission granted $18 instead (with the "New Order" Liberals and corporation unions asking for only $10).

In 2003, in the Minimum Wage Case (the traditional name for the Living Wage Case has been used this round) the ACTU sought a $24.60 a week increase. The Commission granted a two tiered increase: $17 per week for those earning up to and including $731.80, and $15 workers on over $731.80. The "New Order" Liberals and their corporation unions robustly argued against the increase in "living wages".

In 2004: Minimum wage case on May 5, 2004, the claim made by unions in this round was for $26.60 a week but although it was not reached, the AIRC decided on an amount which was far greater than that being asked by corporations and the "New Order" Liberals, $10!!! State and Territory Labor governments were much more in step by supporting $20. The Commission granted $19.

In 2005: the Australian Industrial Relations Commission awarded $17 in the Minimum Wage Case. Again the "New Order" Liberals and their corporation unions argued for $10-$11 and the State and Territory Labor governments argued for $20. This is likely to be the last national wage increase determined by the independent AIRC after a century of tradition. The "New Order" Liberals intend to have future wage decisions set by an agency run by themselves for the business community. If this "agency" had been set up in 1996 it would have delivered $50 less to workers based on Commonwealth submissions over the last 8 years.

So, the Howard mob robustly opposed the reasonable wage increases which they now claim was their decision.

Not the usual lie but, intended to mislead?


Further to that article above.

Authority - ACTU Media Release 27 September 2006.   (As far as I can determine, the media did not pass on this information to the public.  Certainly not as they do for any performance by the "New Order" Liberals.

Quote: "Many working families are struggling to keep their heads above water and the last thing they can afford is a drop in their take home pay as a result of the new IR laws.

"Average earnings in the year to June 2006 dropped in real terms by 1% - that is, working Australians have experienced a fall in average weekly earnings of $11 a week as a result of downward pressure on wages and rising living costs.

"This is the first big drop in average earnings since the introduction of the GST.  If we discount the effect of the GST on living costs, this is the first time that average earnings have declined in real terms for ten years.

"The historically low average earnings are caused by the Federal government's 18 month freeze on pay rises for award wage workers as part of its new IR laws, and a fall in overtime, penalty rate and bonus payments to workers under the laws.

"The Government's own workplace agency (the OEA) has admitted that two thirds (63%) of AWAs registered under the new laws scrap penalty rates, a third cut overtime pay, half get rid of shift allowances and another third do away with public holiday payments.

COMMENT:  And the venal media celebrated this "tragedy unfolding" by showing Howard cutting the cake to celebrate a million Australian workers losing income and security.  That IS the "New Order" from the Liberals. And, as the Toohey drivers declared - "Yes Mr. Howard - the roof IS falling in".

There is no truth - only the powers that be.


To Alan Curran and Jay White.

Thank you for your interaction regarding issues of interest to us all.

However, Fiona's chastisement creates a hitherto unknown limitation on the allocation of daily entries in this forum.

I really do appreciate the fact that you two read my sometimes over-passionate entries.

It is better to be hated or loved than to be ignored.

So, I will try to remain within whatever my limitations are because I would hate to lose my freedom to express my feelings openly and with my heart on my sleeve.

Therefore, I will not enter into any debate with you two, but I will continue to read your entries.

Cheers Ern G.

The truth hurts

 Ernest William, I was not entering into debate with you. I was merely pointing out that you were not facing reality. I just wanted to ask you if you knew that the NSW Labor Party were the biggest importers of foriegn labour, but of course it suits you to ignore this fact.

This is not Madam Lash speaking...

Ernest, I’m sorry if you were unaware of the five post rule. My intention was not chastisement; it was solely to remind both you and Jay White of the posting rule (a topic on which I understand David Roffey will soon be writing) so that you did not exhaust your day’s allowance too early.

In my opinion, well-reasoned comments (and passion is always acceptable) contribute more to the contest of ideas than sniping at particular opponents – a crime which I know that I, like other ‘Diarists, occasionally commit.

Not Madam Lash?

Dr Reynolds, I have it on good authority that your post has mortified both Tom Lewis and Dr Yorick.

Fiona: Since both gentlemen are no longer with us, Malcolm, how could they be anything but mortified?

Australia commences the move to the corruption bottom.

The de-regulation of business in Australia by the "New Order" Liberals has produced that which it must do - unfettered corruption.

The major principle of business is profit, which causes fewer employees, less expenses, fewer overheads, less service, cutting corners, and generally increasing the cost of that lesser quality and quantity service.

The take-overs and amalgamations, which are currently rife in Australia, must cause less full employment; less safety; more fly-by-night opportunists; as an American Texas millionaire once said, "shares are not for the ordinary people, because we can manipulate them".

The seismic shift in Australian values is undermining the future of our children, grandchildren and in my case, great-grandchildren.

The most obvious indication of the venal media's success in conning those susceptible to the "New Order" is the appearance of the small business people believing that Howard's IR laws were, in any way, to improve their future existence.

The laws are a temporary respite from the nasty effect of the "never ever" GST - and as the major players in this globalisation disaster coalesce to funnel through the narrowing of viable businesses in Australia - where will the small business person go?

The contemporary Liberal government of Australia has created such a maelstrom of absolute confusion and obfuscation that even those whose doglike devotion to a once proud Liberal Party have little or no idea what is really going on.

There is only one cure or even a soft landing for this national disaster, and that is the removal of all Federal Liberals who have condoned the destruction of our society for the venal interests of foreign corporations.


The Liberals' false security.

While Howard tries to keep Indonesia on side so that THEY will stop the boat people - consider the real Homeland Security which is nothing more than mirrors and smoke.

The Customs consider that they catch only 30% of the illegal fishing boats off the W.A. coast.  Japanese ships plunder Australian waters unhindered. Papuans virtually "paddle" across to our mainland.  And the "New Order" Liberals are bringing in thousands of foreign labourers, some of whom are reported to be paid in their country of origin.

Now THAT is what Howard calls his security.

He builds a brick wall around our once centre of Democracy in Australia and yet, anyone can reach the "ivory towers" of his Ministries, including his own.

Liberal Joe Hockey says that technology is the best friend of privacy.  Fair dinkum. The complete opposite is the truth.

Credit cards are technology; Computers are technology; phone tapping is technology; Spy satellites are technology et al.

So now the Howard Liberals permit our people's credit card particulars to be transferred to the most corrupt country in the world - India. And the Liberal's de-regulation of big business is reaping the inevitable result of increasing corruption.  And they defend it.

At the 2004 election Howard had his own spin telephoned from the U.S. to every Australian home landline - EVEN those with "silent" numbers!  Now that is his form of security - NONE!

It is obvious that the illegal Iraq invasion has caused a massive resistance to such high-handed and brutal behaviour.

So these Liberals, nit-pick at cheap protection of our Nation while attacking innocent people who have not done us any harm.

The Howard Liberal government IS guilty of allowing the AWB payments for weapons in Saddam Hussein's Iraq, right up to the invasion which they forced us to take part in against a 87% NO poll.

Only the extremely restricted Terms of Reference for the Cole inquiry "shields" them, since Commissioner Cole is FORBIDDEN in finding  any fact or opinion which attaches to Howard, Vaile or Downer in particular.

Hence the reason from the very start of the "Howard style inquiry", he has said "wait for the outcome".  How well he knows what that will be.

False again

Ernest William: "the "New Order" Liberals are bringing in thousands of foreign labourers".

You forgot to mention the fact that the NSW Labor Party are training Chinese workers to take Aussie jobs.

Out of the mouths of babes.

Someone, (I think Alan Curran) presumed that I was being influenced in my opinions by the ACTU website.

Ironically, I have never looked at it until 6th October last.

I thank whoever the bigoted Howard Liberal was, because it is very enlightening.

Example: Does any reader remember Howard and that petulant Liberal Kevin Andrews claiming that the "workers" in the ACTU ads were NOT fair dinkum workers when they made them?

Well, they were in fact workers who volunteered and were identified as such by media reports of an Office of Workplace Services (OWS) "investigation" but were NEVER spoken to or interviewed by the OWS.

These people have suffered pay cuts or have been sacked unfairly and all the Government can do is attack them and say it's their own fault! Fair dinkum.

Now Jay, THERE is a good example of the trashing of basic freedoms of expression – or has that always been an "Australian value"?

There is no truth – only the powers that be.

Fiona: Ernest William and Jay White, given that you have each posted three times already this morning, you might like to take deep breaths and consider well how you use your remaining allocation for today. Some research and links, perhaps?

To Ernest

Ernest William: "Would you please explain the Australian values which say we have not lost!

I think it would be best if you could explain to me, with examples, which values you believe have been lost. After all you are the one making the "values lost" claim.

I see a life in Australia (in relation to values) pretty much as it has always been.

And now the nasty Andrew Robb.

Amongst all of his speeches about how Australians will be forced to act and behave, his claim that in order to obtain a "good job", immigrants will be required to speak English. Fair dinkum.

This is "Howard speak". As we have been informed, the projected 40,000 of foreign workers which the "New Order" Liberals intend to bring into our country by work visas are NOT being asked whether they speak English or not.

Just cheap labour and cheap lives.

You would have to have been a desk jockey all of your life (like Howard and Robb) not to understand how dangerous that stupidity really is.

Wake up Australia.

Hope these answers help

Ernest William: "One final point on this issue (for the time being): can you explain to me why Mr Costello, the Liberal Treasurer, commends the workings and tax dodging by the sect called the Exclusive Brethren, when their "religion" are not allowed to vote in a nation which demands compulsory voting?

Tax dodging? Tax dodging (or avoidance) is an illegal activity. Have you any evidence that this takes place with this group?

Ernest William: "Are they prosecuted to the full extent of the law, or do they vote "New Order" Liberal?

For not voting?

The present system in Australia allows for certain exemptions from voting. Under this system the Brethren are not the only group exempt. This has been the case long before the present Liberal government.

To Ernest William

Ernest William "Do you believe that we have lost our Australian Values?


Ernest William "Do you believe that our "foreign policy" is in the interests of OUR people?


Ernest William "Do you believe that our national resources are being used for the benefit of our citizens?


Ernest William "Do you really believe that the Halliburton U.S. "Vice President's" Company who owns the rail lines from Darwin to Perth is doing it for our benefit?

No. Like every other company (including Australian ones) and investment funds, the over riding motive is profit. That however does not mean investment in Australia is a bad thing.

Ernest William "Do you really believe that Howard's Liberal government is acting as an independent sovereign Nation for the benefits of its citizens?

Yes. However every citizen gets the right to decide this at the next election. The way it has always worked since Federation.

Ernest William "Just consider that the de-regulation of Businesses has had on the scale of "corrupt countries".

Which countries? So corruption never existed before "business de-regulation"?

Just think of the adverse effects Non business de-regulation has had on countries. Think France for starters.

Ernest William "The real culprits are the conga-line of "New Order" Liberals who maintain Howard as their leader - they are Not the Liberals of the past - they are the Hitleristic "New Order" which is forcing our society into a totally oppressed Nation of "White Coolies".

With unemployment under 5%, low inflation and interest rates, economic growth year on year and a nation in the top 15 wealthiest in the world along with being per capita the second wealthiest this place has become a real nightmare.

If things just keep getting worse there will be blood in the streets!

To Jay White.

Would you please explain the Australian values which say we have not lost!

In essence, as a "New Order" Liberal, would you inform me of what your understanding of Australian values really is?

I would welcome a debate on this issue which was initially brought up by Howard – and that is the Karl Rove method of claiming the opposite of the truth.

Let's get into it, Jay.

To Jay White.

Our views are demonstrably opposed as we both would agree. However, mine is the dissent which the Howard "New Order" Liberals tried to crush and, if it wasn't for this Margo Kingston Webdiary and the courageous management team, we would be unable to trade views and opinions at all.

The duplicity and dishonesty of the Federal Liberal Party is obvious and cannot be hidden even by the worse intentions of the venal media corporations.

I could dispute most of what you have answered but, I appreciate that you bothered even to answer at all.

One final point on this issue (for the time being): can you explain to me why Mr Costello, the Liberal Treasurer, commends the workings and tax dodging by the sect called the Exclusive Brethren, when their "religion" are not allowed to vote in a nation which demands compulsory voting?

Are they prosecuted to the full extent of the law, or do they vote "New Order" Liberal?

There is no truth - just the powers that be.


Ernest William, you seem to very good at asking questions, but you are not too keen answer some of the questions I have posed to you.

You still have not told me why  NSW Labor are training workers in China to take Aussie jobs. Is it because you are waiting for clearance from the Unions?, if the question is too hard I will let you "ring a friend".


"New Order" Liberals' duplicity.

"Two bob each way" Liberals are building up their wedges for the election next year.

Just as an example of their ambiguity - how about them pleading "Australian values" to enforce learning English to become an Australian citizen while, at the same time, bringing in Brazilians, Indians, Vietnamese and Chinese (to name a few) on work visas, who cannot speak English at all?

To any worker, especially in the building industry, how dangerous is that?Mr. Georgiou and his small band of "rebels" are singing  a tune of independent thought in the Howard Liberals - that just doesn't exist.

I have no idea of Mr. Georgiou's past and I don't need to know - but what I DO know is that in all of the horrendous, archaic and damaging legislations that his Howard government has perpetrated over the last decade - he has agreed.

It is symbolic to say the best about such pointless opposition - a show of "democracy"?  I think not - nay, I know not.

The conga-line is only allowed a few backbenchers to "appear to oppose" some of the inane and unimportant policies - and even cross the floor - for it matters not.

I cannot understand the Federal Labor Party bothering to attack Howard.  He is only a U.S. puppet and as such wields a "big stick" to enforce their policies, here and abroad.

The real culprits are the conga-line of "New Order" Liberals who maintain Howard as their leader - they are not the Liberals of the past - they are the Hitleristic "New Order" which is forcing our society into a totally oppressed Nation of "White Coolies".

There is no truth - just the powers that be.

Let's talk facts

Ernest William: "Fact: The N.S.W. Rural press is owned and run by the Liberal Corporations and are mainly responsible for the elections of Liberals in State; Andrew Constance and in Federal; Gary Nairn".

Huh? Rural Press is owned by a wing of the Fairfax family.

Fact: The ACTU has gone on a massive advertising spree with its members’ money.

Fact: It is a save their highly paid arses campaign.

Fact: It is depleting their resources and will leave little to kick the Labor can in the on coming election.

Fact: One ad was found to fraudulent.

Fact: They will have to increase membership fees to put money into the Labor campaigns.

Fact: Most of the ACTU head will leave the sinking ship for cushy political jobs.

Fact: Most of the leadership have never done a honest hard days work in their lives.

To Jay White.

Thank you for your resposte Jay.  Both of us should be concerned with "facts" not opinions. 

Just an aside Jay, IF I had highlighted OPINIONS it could have been offensive - and I would understand.

You may disagree with that which I say are facts and, you can ask that I prove every point, however, to use the same analogy, can you prove your claims?

I have wanted to write more Jay but, while we are diametrically opposed in our political views, are we concerned with the future of Australia?

Do you believe that we have lost our Australian Values? Do you believe that our "foreign policy" is in the interests of OUR people?  Do you believe that our national resources are being used for the benefit of our citizens?  Do you really believe that the Halliburton U.S. "Vice President's" Company who owns the rail lines from Darwin to Perth is doing it for our benefit?

Do you really believe that Howard's Liberal government are acting as an indepependent soveriegn Nation for the benefits of its citizens?

Just consider that the de-regulation of Businesses has had on the scale of  "corrupt countries".

There is no truth - only the powers that be.


Fact:  The media has reported that the Howard "New Order" Liberals have increased by 70% the amount of money each individual can donate to their fascist regime.

Fact:  The Corporations regularly pay huge sums to support their U.S. puppet Liberal government and attend grossly expensive "dinners" for the same reason.

Fact:  The "New Order" Liberals bribed National Barnaby Joyce into selling out Telstra, and his constituents, with a 3 million (or was it Billion) slush fund for their next election.  Shades of John Anderson!

Fact:  The media Corporations "donate" to the Howard Liberals a 10 to 1 ratio of exposure as opposed to Labor, Democrats, Greens or even the Family First.

Fact:  The N.S.W. Rural press is owned and run by the Liberal Corporations and are mainly responsible for the elections of Liberals in State; Andrew Constance and in Federal; Gary Nairn.

Fact:  All Radio Station Corporations have entered into the "paid for comment" bulletins which applauds  the Howard decade of lies.

The above are all Business Unions, Associations or Foreign Interests.

SO WHY shouldn't the only organised representatives of the middle and lower class people of Australia, support the major opposition to that "Ivory Tower" Australian hegemony?

That is part of the Americanisation of our once proud Nation - the obscene U.S. style of "Anyone can be President" - IF he/she has the billions of dollars backing of the Corporations - especially the Military/Corporate.

Surely George W. Bush is a perfect example of that?

The simple answer is that the Howard Liberals have been suppressing free speech and dissent since 1998 and they cannot stand up to any opposition on a "level playing ground".

There is no truth - only the powers that be.

There would be something in it for them

Alan Curran: "Ernest William, could it be right that the NSW Labor government is training Chinese workers to come and work in Australia and take Aussie jobs. There must be something in it for the Unions if Labor are doing this, maybe they are looking for new members."

I think Ernest should be able to tell you. Reading much of his propaganda it is apparent that this is ACTU advertising. The only thing improving amongst this mob is their pay packets.

Watch these rats begin to leave the sinking ship in the next few years. I am tipping cushy jobs in various state upper houses.

Individual AWAs further the Liberal's bastardry.

It is reported that the Australian Federal Police were "offered" individual contracts (similar to those in Queensland in 1890) and they bluntly refused.

It is reasonable to argue then, that individual AWAs are really intended to weaken resistance to the draconian laws, and the targets are those whose only strength is Unions.

It would be interesting to discover whether the State Police Forces and Fire Brigades are also refusing individual contracts.

How about the Ambulance crews and para-medics.

The claims made by a desperate Liberal Kevin Andrews, that hundreds of thousands of "jobs" have been created (BECAUSE of these laws) is up there with the most blatant lies of this predatory Liberal government.

Since "employment" under the Howard Liberals includes one hour (1) per week, at the time of the census, that would be because of the sackings and part-time AWAs. Now that is BECAUSE of these laws.

They are NOT increasing JOBS - only time slots in jobs that already exist!

Note that Howard's Corporations government is now having to "pay the piper" for their support.

Even with the media's limited truth provision, we still discover that the Corporations are now abusing (or using) the Liberal's working visas to replace Australian workers.

What price now for the Australian "white coolies"?

Middle Australia better wake up quickly, or do the American way of taking out insurance against losing your job.


What is employment under the Liberals?

I do not have the original "goal posts" which existed before the "New Order" Liberals changed them.

Surely, we all know that "statistics" is one of the most prevalent "lies"? And the Howard Liberals have made it into an art.

Consider for one moment, if you were one of the "employed" who is working in a small business, a few days or hours a week?

The major employer according to the Federal Liberal Government is the "small businesses".

It is therefore understandable that the "part time", "easy to sack" Liberal laws encourage an insecure and fearful attitude in the let's forget the "untermenschen".

We have to consider that some 30% of the Australian workers (not including Howard's foreigners) are under-employed!

If you factor in the pressure that the Liberals put on people who have the audacity to claim unemployment, then you have a punishment society that demands the result of false economy statistics.

Remember this.  The freedom of Webdiary that you are now enjoying is always under threat and the people who have the courage to dissent, are doing our nation a service.

This service is a "pressure release valve" for a decent nation of people who have been taken up by the spin of 911.

Yes, of course I care - do you?

Shades of the Menzies' Corporations.

Not many people may remember the clear threat by the U.S. Company, General Motors Holden, in Fisherman's Bend Victoria many years ago.

The citizens of our Nation were horrified at the blackmail and audacity of this foreign Company in threatening our Government that, unless they get their way, they will close down their factory and sack all employees.

Does any of the older generation remember?

This act of clear bastardry would have caused havoc in all associated industries.  The people power and the Australian Value of "well, do it and we will take over after you go", didn't happen.  It is clear that the Corporation got their own way.

Now that we have a much worse Corporations Government of the people, by the Corporations and for the Corporations - history is repeating itself.

One of the major "credit card debt" purveyors, aptly named, American Express, has come out in the open to tell the Howard Liberals what they want regarding foreign slave workers.  And the old Australian value is not there. And we are as captive to their demands as the Howard Liberals are for their financial support.

I have always argued that a Nation completely controlled by Corporations Unions or Workers' Unions, will always be hostage to the demands of the Captains of those organisations.

These are the faceless men - these are the people elected to their positions of authority by the direct group whose demands they try to satisfy.

The Corporations Unions (Business Council of Australia etc.) are elected by those who will solely benefit from their power and the Worker's Unions and the "swingers" have no vote.

The Workers' Unions (Australian Council of Trade Unions) are also elected by those who will benefit from their power and the Corporations and swingers have no vote.

In other words, the Nation is run by people who are NOT elected by the people.

The title of "lefty" or "fascist" does not apply to socialists.  They are neither and, I believe, are the future of the World IF it continues to exist.

Then, just maybe, the media will owe it's existence to the majority of the citizens of the Nation.

Howard's legacy is a poorer Australia.

A Nation is as rich as it's poorest citizen.

The Liberals have continued to divide and lie to our people since 1998, when Howard sold his soul to the U.S. for their support.

Since then, he has held on to power by the grace of the U.S. administration and the Corporations for whom he governs.

Currently the Liberals are condemning the Solomon Island's twice democratically elected government for exercising their inalienable right to persona non grata any foreign representative who interferes in the politics of the host Nation.

It should have been done by any Australian Government with a debt to the electorate, in 2004.  The unbelievable and patronising image of those Bush Nazis is still fresh in my mind.  Mr. Schaeffer should have been dismissed for his unprofessional and dispicable interference.

The "outrageous" statement by Lord Downer of Baghdad was something to read.  He says, in effect, that the P.M. of the Solomon Islands is not above the law - even though he is a Prime Minister.  Fair dinkum. What a hypocrite?

As a dishonest person himself, in the dishonest Ministry, of a dishonest Government Party, he should look inwardly before throwing stones.

The behaviour of the Howard government, being the servant of the U.S. as their Deputy Sheriff in South East Asia, is nothing short of disgraceful.

These Liberals have no idea of diplomacy, nor any idea how these poorer people are trying to set up THEIR democracy without the interference of a U.S. puppet government.

Reason - IF the Liberals are "helping" the democratically elected government of the Solomons, why were the riots at their peak after the Government sent troops and police to DICTATE Howard's U.S. policies? Why were our personnel mainly occupied by protecting foreign businesses in that sovereign Nation.

They have been a Parliamentary Democracy since the 1970's.  If they have exercised the U.S. crap of what constitutes a "democracy", WHY are we dictating to them instead of helping them?

IF Howard's Liberals have really sent help, why were they troops, why Federal Police?  It seems to me, when you sort out the reports, that the Solomons are only in termoil because of foreign interests which they consider belong to them.

And Howard treats them as lesser beings - as his history of racism is well recorded.

Wake up Australia - we have a dysfuncional and confused Liberal government who simply follow the directions of the U.S.

There is no truth - only the powers that be.

Truth will out

Ernest William, could it be right that the NSW Labor government is training Chinese workers to come and work in Australia and take Aussie jobs. There must be something in it for the Unions if Labor are doing this, maybe they are looking for new members.

Wake up Ernest William, you are being conned by Labor and the Unions.

Ernest William, "The

Ernest William:

"The Liberals have continued to divide and lie to our people since 1998, when Howard sold his soul to the U.S. for their support".

"Since then, he has held on to power by the grace of the U.S. administration and the Corporations for whom he governs".

Where do you get this rubbish from?He won the elections because of his policies something you are obviously unable to understand.

Indeed, Wake up Australia - we have a dysfuncional and confused Labor opposition who simply follow the directions of the Unions who with their stunts and lies are going to ensure Howard gets another four years in office.

Changes? Fair Dinkum!!!

"Howard softens IR laws: report" declares ninemsn.  What rubbish!

ANY changes in the Howard Liberal's disgraceful abuse of Australian values with the I.R. legislation, will be as secret and dishonest as all of those "back-downs" have been in the past.  Judge his record of lies.

Everything with these Federal Liberals is orchestrated  and diversionary.

For example, HOW can these draconian laws force an Employer NOT TO PUNISH a worker for being sick, when they can still sack them, at their leisure, with impunity?

CASHING OUT ANNUAL LEAVE is "prohibited" under the "changes" except when an employee submits a request in writing.  Fair dinkum? This is a "Clayton's" prohibition while the Laws that force a prospective Employee to sign an individual AWA, (with whatever conditions or be turned away) remain in force.  Therefore a not too gentle suggestion by the employer to sign a request to cash out Annual Leave is there "on the table"!

ANY change in the 1850's by the Howard Liberals, like the "never-ever" GST, will be a change to increase the destruction of the rights and entitlements of the insecure and brain-washed public - should they elect them again!

NOTHING has changed to the benefit of ANY employee - NOTHING.

Do you really think for one moment that these "New Order" Liberals have ANY thoughts about changing their direction towards a "sweat shop" under-class society?

Should they be re-elected the hardship of the ordinary Australian will continue to increase until the "1984" predictions meet Howard's 25 year objective.  The working poor.

There is no truth - just the powers that be.

It's Time for a reality check Mk. I.

Referring to Google "The Living Wage".

"The name "Fair Pay Commission sounds a little like Orwell's Ministry Of Love; it carries the same stale air of propaganda about it.  The "Fair Pay" Commission is one of the central planks of the Federal Government's new industrial relations legislation (legislation which, with equal Orwellian panache, has been named WorkChoices), and it is set to replace the Industrial Relations Commission as the body that will decide the minimum wage for Australian workers.  It will be a five-person, Government-appointed panel, recallable only once every five years, and its decisions will not be reversible.  'You may think that's too much power.' said the proposed head of the Commission, Ian Harper, 'and you may be right'." 

Continuing: "If you are a young or trainee worker, or unemployed, or disabled, or a casual worker in an non-unionised workplace, or if you don't have any qualifications and so are employed in an 'unskilled' industry; or do have qualifications and are employed in such an industry anyway, the "Fair Pay" Commission wnad the (non-reversible) decisions that it makes will affect you.  The minimum wage is the foundation for workplace conditions across the country.  It is the basic hourly rate that employers must legally adhere to (although some do not), currently set at $12.75 an hour.  The take-home pay for a full-time employee on the minimum wage is currently $484.40 a week, which is defined as a 'living wage'.  It might sound like a king's ransom to those on the dole, but for a worker who might be trying to support a family, or has debts or medical costs, or is struggling to pay rent in a city like Sydney, it can be very difficult.  The Australian Council of Trade Unions (ACTU) estimates that there are currently more than one million Australian workers living below the poverty line, with about 90,000 relying on charity to supplement their 'living wage'.

One of the scariest things about this WorkChoice legislation is that it contains no provisions or guarantees for any kind of 'living wage' to be maintained.  The "Fair Pay" Commission isn't obliged to protect living standards, or take account of inflation or price rises.  The Commission will not be allowed to set the minimum wage lower than it currently is - the Government has been very keen to emphasise this - but neither will it be obliged to make it higher.  So, although $12-75 an hour may just scrape through as 'living wage' now, in ten years time - or possibly two - it will not.  Allowing the minimum wage to stagnate is not the full extent of the Government's intentions.  If you are a young worker (under 21), or disabled, or unemployed, you fall into the Government's 'special minimum wage" category, which some Government figures suggest should be as low as $4,75 an hour."  End of quote - for now.

Just for now - NE OUBLIE.

It's time for a reality check - Mk 11.

Continuing after "....Government figures suggest should be as low as $4.75 an hour."

"The 'problem', according to the Government and those economists who advise it, is that these 'special' workers are currently not paid at 'competitive' rates.  'Establishing genuine minimum wages and conditions will assist in achieving increased labour market participation says the WorkChoices legislation, in other words: those already at the bargain-bin end of the workforce are actually not cheap enough.  Cheaper workers theoretically means that businesses will hire more of them, which means that (at least on paper) the unemployment statistics will shrink.  Meanwhile, in the real world, the 'special minimum wage' workforce earning just $4.75 an hour will be living in extreme poverty.

The cut-rate youth worker wage is not a new idea.  John Howard was talking about it back in 1992, when he was Shadow Employment Minister in the Federal Opposition.  He called for a minimum youth wage of $3 to $3.50 per hour, arguing that young people were desperate to get their foot in the workplace door, yet employers were reluctant to hire them at established junior wage rates - so lowering the wage would make everybody happy.  'Let's just understand that we're not talking about poverty, we're talking about giving young people the opportunity of getting started,' he said (for the full transcript of Howard's 1992 ABC Radio interview on the topic, head to www.actu.asn.au). End of quote.

More Howardistic mumbo jumbo.

It is reported that the rising taxes are catching out more families. 

Like most, if not all of the so-called benefits of the Howard Liberals, the "family benefits" there are hidden strings attached.  The policies of the Liberals has effectively increased the marginal tax rates to more than 50%.   Certainly a left pocket to right pocket con eh?

These increases in tax apply to one in seven families with children, up from one in 22 B.H. (Before Howard).

For sole parents, the proportion has risen from one in 13 to one in five B.H.

The Age article adds that "It shows that government policies  discourage key groups of skilled people from working, just as the economy faces an ageing population and a shortage of skilled workers".  In short, it taxes them out of the workforce!

"It shows that, for every dollar earned at these higher income levels, no matter from where the income derives, people affected are paying more in tax than they are allowed to keep".

After impoverishing TAFE and it's skill programs, this "economical" government then creates tax disincentives which keeps skilled workers at bay.  Clever.

Then, because of the shortage, and the doctored "move the goalposts" employment figures, the government says "we must bring in skilled labour".

Then it brings in unskilled labour and while it is at it, Howard's Liberals bring in Argentinians for the Abattoirs.  Argentina is America's choice for prime meat and is not supposed to benefit from Howard's U.S. FTA.  Meanwhile another Abattoir in Queensland is closing down in Toowoomba.

Add to this the movement off shore of occupied jobs by the U.S. Corporation Bank, WESTPAC. 

And that brilliant personage Amanda Vanstone will say, "It proves our policies are working".  Fair dinkum.


Delusions To The Left of Me, Delusions To The Right

Phil Moffat: "There is a very simple answer to why people loose their homes; misfortunate and or ignorance. To a degree one can insure against misfortune but one cannot control world or domestic affairs. At best we can vote for the party that will best look after our interests and hope for the best".

This is quiet correct, Phil. Also peoples' "interests" will vary depending on the situation they find themselves in.

Phil Moffat: "Sadly it is also ignorance, greed and dreams that also get families into financial stress, which in itself fuels (fuelled) the boom. Before deregulation if one wanted a home loan then one had to go cap in hand to the local bank manager and apply for a loan. The bank managers in those days were prudent and required bona fides and the ability for the applicant to service the loan, otherwise, no loan and one would have to save a larger deposit or increase their income."

It also must be remembered that financial institutions can also lose out in a credit free for all. For example a large amount of "bad loans" can lead to a situation of "bad loses". Remember the late 80's and early 90's? There really is no such thing as a bad borrower only a poor lender.

It must also be remembered that in the "old days" many simply did not get the chance to buy their own home. For many lower income people it took many years to be a realistic home owner. Everything in those days relied upon a nod and a wink from the local power broker in the form of a bank manager.

A less class orientated society some may be deluded into thinking, I say think again. Many a person spent more than a few years lining the pockets of the lucky in the form of rent, when they could well have been working on their own mortgage. I prefer that people and lenders come to their own private decisions. This is called choice and it does not always end in tears.

No government can ever take care of a persons private finances. Never has been the case and never will be the case. A young person needs only good health and a decent tax regime. Everything else should with prudence, look after itself. I remember the times when I thought marriage would mean lots and lots of good sex as well as a great home cooked meal every night and the housework being done for me. It would appear many now seem to think it automatically means owning a million plus house in a beachside suburb. Having my private myth exploded I must admit was a lot less costly.

Labor has no answers to one owning ones own home. If fact the start of the current downward property market was started by the greedy NSW state government and its taxes. Anyhow that is by the by and the property market like everything else has its cycles. Booms and busts have happened before and the will happen again. Irrespective of who is in government.

Ernest William writes in propaganda and delusion, as such it is devoid of reality.  Merely preaching to the already converted.

At least some truth from a New Order Liberal.

There are actually some truths in your attempt to excuse the Howard government's failure, as always, in duty of care.

Simply put, the de-regulation of all constaints on big business is not only unnecessary but an abdication of the duty of a government which still claims to be "democratic". Their first duty is government of the people, by the people and for the people

They are a government of depraved indifference as their behaviour in both foreign and domestic policies clearly show.

The essence of what you are really saying is that the Liberal's bear no blame for the fact that (as you say) they allowed the banks and financial institutions to "attract the flies to the spider". The Liberal's actively baited this trap with the non means tested "First Home Buyers" loan. Caveat Emptor as Howard so blithely says.

Let me just ask you - do you really conclude that the blame in this disgrace to "Australia's values" is the ignorance of the people? Come in sucker? Never give a sucker a break?

Do you really excuse the Financial Institutions for exploiting the people who elected this government to protect them from attack from without and within? Do you feel that their behaviour in falsifying the "assets" in the applications, particularly the wages (as reported in your media) was "honest business practice"?

When I was a 22 year old Sailor with a Wife and three sons to support, I could not get a bank loan unless I could prove that I didn't need it. It was the responsibility of the lender  to ensure that the borrower was capable of servicing the loan and to have evidence to that effect. Collateral so to speak. That way the bank protected itself AND, might I say, the unachievable aspirations of ordinary citizens.

In retrospect, I thank God that I was not in that position with a Howard Liberal government, otherwise I would have been suffering equally as much as the youngsters of today - while the wealthy are having a field day as "investors".

You appear to be an educated person albeit with ice in your veins.

Let's have your opinion of "Australian Values" and apply them to this "New Order" Liberal government.

Our own worst enemies

More and more families are losing their homes. A combination of factors no doubt but both sides (of politics) are trying to exploit the situation to their advantage, that’s politics.

There is a very simple answer to why people loose their homes; misfortunate and or ignorance.

To a degree one can insure against misfortune but one cannot control world or domestic affairs. At best we can vote for the party that will best look after our interests and hope for the best.

Sadly it is also ignorance, greed and dreams that also get families into financial stress, which in itself fuels (fuelled) the boom. Before deregulation if one wanted a home loan then one had to go cap in hand to the local bank manager and apply for a loan. The bank managers in those days were prudent and required bona fides and the ability for the applicant to service the loan, otherwise, no loan and one would have to save a larger deposit or increase their income.

Today with deregulation and competition the banks (and lenders) are not so prudent and approve loans without due diligence. The recipient of the loan will be quite happy to put the noose around their necks to make that dream come true, even if it means stretching their finances to the limit.

Those who foolishly choose to take on a mortgage they will struggle to repay leave themselves exposed to any increases in household costs, such as petrol, interest rates, medications or an unplanned pregnancy etc.

Personally I would be very careful to take on a mortgage that requires two incomes to service, but in this day and age that is the norm, as such, there are many more families who place themselves (willingly) in a vulnerable position.

Somehow I feel that if screening of potential mortgagees was done more prudently and applicants had to provide all the bona fides there would be fewer people in trouble, they maybe still renting but at least they will be free of financial stress, which in itself is a major cause of divorce. Less people buying homes, less demand, slower price rises.

It will be those things we can’t control, such as interest rates and petrol that we will choose to blame for our misfortune when in reality it has more to do our with our inability or reluctance to plan in a prudent and responsible manner.

Sometimes we are our own worst enemies.

The decimated truth of the Liberal's false economy.

 The predicted repossessions of Howard's "First home buyer con" are indeed increasing at an alarming rate.

The Age has reported that in Victoria, home-loan defaults have increased by a massive 50% on last year and upwards of 95% relate to private home owners defaulting on mortgage repayments. The SMH reports the same re-claiming of private homes in N.S.W.

Why I write this in the "Work Changes" issues is that the media is trying to blame odds and ends which they say Howard could do nothing about.

Let's have a reality check.  Howard de-regulated petrol at the bowser saying that it would lower prices and stabilise throughout the country.  The opposite happened as indeed,  was inevitable.

Howard led us into a cowardly, illegal and pre-emptive war against a sovereign Nation who were (at that time) the second highest producer of Oil in the world.  Since then, prices have been increasing regularly, with all sorts of excuses like some isolated Refinery in Canada closing down.  Fair dinkum.

While petrol is a part of the problem (and Howard could do something) there is also the three rate rises since Howard's last election and the fact that there has been seven (7) Bank rate rises since 2002.

That is scary enough but, add to that the price rises in everything especially food and then consider the effect of more and more of the middle and lower workers are commonly losing 30% of their weekly income due to Howard's I.R. legislation.

Work out your own priorities, if you were one of those trapped into a massive mortgage by a government of depraved indifference.  Of course the home, and your equity in it, has to go for the survival of your family.

The so-called constant "consumer" figures are based on spending - ask your Lady friends what they perceive with food shopping.  It is not that we are buying more or the same - it is because the cost of what we buy is going up with a proportionate reduction in what we take home.

Howard's business is; reduce services, increase costs, reduce job security, increase profits, reduce incomes and deregulate Big business. His debt laden false economy has been teetering on the edge for at least two years - and that is with massive commodity booms in W.A. and Queensland.

His 21% interest rates when he was Treasurer in 1982 is a true indication of his ability on economic matters.  His Treasurer Mr. Costello, lost 6 million of our taxpayer's money while gambling on the International Money Market.  Additionally, they have raised the taxes to the highest ever in Australia with increases and more types being added all the time but, you are fed this intermittently and you forget - don't you?

Someone once wrote in Webdiary - "We work to live, not live to work".  Amen.

If you cannot obtain a permanent and secure job with a living wage - you are in enough trouble without the Liberal's financial blundering.


Ernest William, where do you get these facts from "middle and lower workers are commonly losing 30% of their weekly income due to Howard's I.R. legislation". Is it any wonder that we dare not trust Labor with the economy when people like you have no idea what they are talking about.

Is Mr. Costello's, lost 6 million of our taxpayer's money while gambling on the International Money Market, worse than Beazley's 8 Billion blackhole? More good Labor economics.

"If you cannot obtain a permanent and secure job with a living wage - you are in enough trouble without the Liberal's financial blundering", have you any conception of what it would be like under a Labor government? Does not bear thinking about really.

As I have said before any idiot who takes out a mortgage without being able withstand a rate rise of a quarter of a percent, should not be let out on their own. Nobody gets trapped into a massive mortgage by any government, it is not compulsory.

Jews - please take notice.

Hitler used the concentration of hatred as his weapon to "unite" the ravaged people of Germany.  He chose the Jews and we all know the tragic outcome of that ideology.

The Howard Liberals are using hatred and fear in the same manner.  Sure it comes from their servile attitude to the Bush administration in the U.S. but, why do we condone it?

The Muslims who live in this country of ours, have either been born here or have immigrated under Australian law - even that of the Howard administration.

Remember "we will decide who comes to our country and the way in which they come" - or something to that effect.

Some of our citizens travel overseas to admire or absorb the ancient civilisations and their diverse customs.  There is a long and successful history to these "old" countries and we should learn by their experiences.

Howard's hatred of Asians is history, and his recent attack on any Muslim in this country or anywhere, has no merit in logic.

Labor Senator John Faulkner (NSW) stated: "I will pass over the irony of the Prime Minister who leads the most un-Australian government we have ever had actually advising anyone at all on what Australian values are.  His values are about a widening gap between rich and poor, about the invasion of another country based on a lie, about distorting Australian democracy.  But I cannot pass over him using the rights of Australian women as an excuse to attack part of our community.  When Mr. Howard says migrants 'must be fully prepared to embrace Australian attitudes towards women', that is a dog whistle he is blowing".  Unquote.

If anyone has read my history of Leichhardt NSW - many of the elderly women of that community still cannot speak English - and what do we do about that Howard? They are lovely people.

How un Australian

Ernest, I suppose our indigenous people who only speak their traditional tongue must also be of concern; I mean, been here for yonks and still don’t speak English, how un- Australian.

Don't Forget the Women

Indeed, Phil. I note that our illustrious leader is a bit light on comment when it come to expressing concern for the rights of Aboriginal women, especially the five-year-old-anally-raped variety. At least Mal Brough, Nannette Rogers, Tony Jones and a few others are speaking up about it. This is despite the fact that they may get a broadside from some segments of the community who feel that Aboriginal cultural sensitivities are more sensitive than shredded infant sphincters. As a result, women and children will continue to be brutalised for sometime to come because some segments of the community are scared of being politically incorrect or, worse still, guilty of repeating history by removing the children from harms way.

It is a curious and frightful moral turpitude that would allow all manner of abominations to continue for the sake of not being seen to be creating another stolen generation. Just as it is an immature and ideologically driven mind that cannot allow a lesser evil for the greater good, it is a truly nasty person who would ignore human suffering for the sake of preserving an unblemished philosophical architecture. Again I wonder, why is our leadership, across all spectra, so silent on this issue?


Alan Curran: "Whilst watching the news I see that all the officials are very good at doing B-B-Ques and given out flags and swanning around in fancy tee-shirts. I think it would be better if they sat down and read the law, but of course that would be asking too much of these simpletons".

Along with having the seemingly super human ability of collecting well above average wages and conditions regardless of performance. That is if Combet and his token offsider are anything to go by. I mean how much has union membership contracted say in the last twenty five years?

I guess not being up with the latest "union beliefs" I might not be a expert however what actually is success based on in this organisation? Perhaps we could have "dancing with union officals" to cull the gold from the chaff? Seriously, does somebody not think it about time this mob had at least something resembling a blueprint of going forward? I mean how far can hoping to get a stooge elected go? How far can hopes of press ganging a large percentage of the unwilling population into an organisation stretch? How long can an "organisation" last on hope alone?

Now if this thread, and its ACTU lifted propaganda, are anything to go by, the standard is not high. With the next round of pay rises, and I suspect that will be soon, would it not be advisable for at least someone to look like they're even slightly attempting to sing for their supper?

Fair dinkum, where do they find people to get on the payroll? Is being the head of the ACTU now the equivalent of best paid "fire watcher" in the known world?

A serious insult Amanda

After the disclosure of the blatant criminal treatment of a Chinese National in Melbourne, the Immigration "Minister" Amanda Vanstone stated that this proved the visa system works. Fair dinkum.

For some time my wife and I tried to fathom the logic in that claim without success.

A person is forced to pay exorbitant fees to his employer - and to a "people smuggler" in China - then to be "allowed to work" in this great country for $400 less than the wages he was entitled to?

This is a perfect example of the "sweat shop" and "Coolie" workers that the "Howard" Liberals have been aiming for. It is exploitation at its worst and we can be sure that this is only the tip of the iceberg.

BUT - the man was able to complain!! According to Vanstone, THAT proves their system works. Of course he was sacked and evicted from his residence under the Liberal's "Work Choices" legislation and has no recourse but to cop it. I haven't heard the Howard/Downer complain lately about China's abuse of human rights and I can understand that, since the Liberals have legislated to make this also a country of legal employment exploitation.

I believe that Worker's Unions are trying to help the man as they have been doing since Howard's draconian laws were introduced.

The only hope ordinary Australians have over the Slave labour visa system, is that they can join a UNION for mutual protection.

I would be rushing to join one ASAP if I was one of Howard's targets.

So the Liberals are bringing out their "big guns" on I.R.

It is reported that the "pleasant fat fellow" Joe Hockey, will now sell the "Workplace Choices" NO CHOICE legislation to the Australian people.

This is the man who three times on Seven Sunrise spoke up for his Prime Minister's decision to sell the Snowy River scheme - and, on the same day, without any word from his master, Hockey discovered that Howard had scrapped the deal. The choice of Joe Hockey is also a massive slap in the face for Kevin Andrews who, although doing a "Sisyphus" for Howard's 150 year retrospective legislation, didn't really deserve the disloyalty nor the embarrassment. I actually felt sorry for the fellow when the pressure really got to him - which is indicative of a Labor voter when you have the ability to feel for a person who has totally opposing politics.

For a long time now the ultra-conservative Channel 7 has portrayed Joe Hockey and Kevin Rudd as equals in debate. There are a few Howardistic motives there. Joe Hockey is a jovial, likeable but relatively low level Minister in the Liberal government. Conversely Kevin Rudd is a brilliant, well-educated and articulate shadow foreign Minister. Surely a "fair go" by a decent media outlet would at least insist on persons with equal standing in their respective party's hierarchy but, that is not the Howard Liberal's way.

So, Channel 7 should have insisted that the Liberal's Foreign Minister, Alexander Downer, should debate with Kevin Rudd! Knowing the Howard twisted mind, that imbalance would be a wonderful insult to Mr Rudd - and it would have been to the people broadcasting Seven Sunrise. But then, in the Howard Liberal's "Australia", equal right are a no-no and his media claims that that is brilliant politics. Fair dinkum.

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