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Anti-terrorism laws - links update #4

Seditious opinion? Lock 'em up
Media Watch 24 October 2005
An expert legal opinion obtained by Media Watch on the impact of the new Anti-Terrorism Bill says that journalists and the commentators they interview might be caught out by the new laws on sedition.
In last week's show we drew your attention to the new sedition offences, as proposed in the leaked draft of the government's Anti Terrorist bill, which is still on our website.
Dictionaries define sedition as conduct or language inciting rebellion against the government. As a criminal offence it has a long and dishonourable history as a means of shutting down political dissent, back in the Cold War and before.
Our concern is how the new sedition offences might criminalise the expression, reporting and publication of the range of opinions in our society. - http://www.abc.net.au/mediawatch/transcripts/s1489465.htm

Bracks, Beattie on anti-terror laws
Lateline, Australian Broadcasting Corporation, Broadcast: 19/10/2005
TONY JONES: Towards the end of the 19th century, Germany's first chancellor Otto von Bismark wrote that there are two things the public should never see - the making of sausages and the making of laws. Well, since the ACT Chief Minister, Jon Stanhope, posted the Government's draft anti-terror legislation on his website, the Australian public have had a unique insight into that dark art. Several of the state premiers, who signed up to support the new laws at the recent COAG meeting, have said Stanhope shouldn't have done it, the draft should have been kept secret for their Cabinets to examine without public pressure. But now, with so much detail out in public, two of those premiers have told us there's a lot in the draft they never agreed to. I spoke to the Victorian Premier, Steve Bracks, and the Queensland Premier, Peter Beattie, in their respective offices earlier this evening. Thanks to both of you for joining us. - http://www.abc.net.au/lateline/content/2005/s1486208.htm See also this article.

UK counter-terrorism laws subject to greater scrutiny than Australia's
ABC Online, Australia- 24 October 2005
TONY JONES: Now to tonight's guest - Dr Angela Ward is an Australian-born barrister working in Britain and Associate Professor of Law at Essex University. She's appeared as counsel in human rights cases at all levels of Britain's courts, from magistrates through to the House of Lords. As such, she's expert in the Human Rights Act which underpins Britain's anti-terror laws. Since the Australian Government announced its plans to borrow from those British laws to create it's own new anti-terror regime, Dr Ward has been examining the similarities and the fundamental differences. So how do the two stack up against each other? I spoke to her in our London studio just a short time ago. Angela Ward, thanks for joining us. - http://www.abc.net.au/lateline/content/2005/s1489692.htm

Proposed counter-terrorism laws may face constitutional challenge
Lateline, Australian Broadcasting Corporation: 25/10/2005
TONY JONES: Well, Federal Government lawyers will examine new advice that the Commonwealth's draft anti-terror laws could breach the Constitution. The advice prepared for the Queensland Premier, Peter Beattie, has warned that the laws relating to preventative detention and control orders for terror suspects could be open to a High Court challenge. But the Prime Minister says his legal advisors have not raised any such doubts. From Canberra, Narda Gilmore reports - http://www.abc.net.au/lateline/content/2005/s1490610.htm

Voters say yes to terror Australis
SMH, By David Humphries, October 25, 2005
Australians overwhelmingly endorse the anti-terrorism plan agreed by the Commonwealth, states and territories, but strongly oppose the one key point of political dispute - John Howard's push to give police new shoot-to-kill powers over suspects.
According to the latest Herald Poll, about three-quarters of voters think it is OK to lock up suspected terrorists without charge, put them under house arrest or shackle them with tracking devices. - http://www.smh.com.au/news/national/voters-say-yes-to-terror-australis/2005/10/24/1130006061361.html

Labor toes the terror line
The Age October 22, 2005
Fear of the electorate, as much as terrorism, is driving Beazley and the premiers, writes Shaun Carney.
BEATTIE: "Let me tell you, if we ended up with a position where we had a terrorist attack in this nation and we weren't ready and we didn't have the laws in place, let me tell you whose heads would be on the block: the Prime Minister and every state leader in this nation. And, frankly, we've got a moral obligation to ensure that we get the appropriate protection in place to safeguard Australians and that's exactly what we will do." - http://www.theage.com.au/news/shaun-carney/labor-toes-the-terror-line/2005/10/21/1129775953598.html See also the Lateline transcript  above: http://www.abc.net.au/lateline/content/2005/s1486208.htm

Beware the virtue of activist lawyers pretending to do good
The Australian, Janet Albrechtsen October 12, 2005
Wrong. Look a little closer at these civil liberties groups, so readily quoted in the media, and it soon becomes apparent that these are a small band of activist lawyers with an agenda much like any other lobby group. Even a cursory look at who they are, what they stand for and what they do reveals that "civil libertarian" is being used as a feel-good phrase, a smokescreen intended to hide political and personal agendas cunningly camouflaged as community welfare. - http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/common/story_page/0,5744,16889146%255E32522,00.html

Legal concerns prompt terror summit
Australian, Australia - 25 October 2005
AUSTRALIA'S legal chiefs will hold an urgent meeting after two state governments warned tough new anti-terror laws could breach the constitution. - http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/common/story_page/0,5744,17031762%255E1702,00.html

Anti-terrorism laws threaten media freedom
The Age - 25 October 2005
Hampering the work of journalists will not enhance our security, writes Andrew Jaspan. - http://www.theage.com.au/news/opinion/antiterrorism-laws-threaten-media-freedom/2005/10/24/1130006058337.html

Howard says counter-terrorism laws are constitutional
ABC Online, Australia - 25 October 2005
The Prime Minister has rejected the claims made by Queensland's top legal bureaucrat that the Federal Government's proposed counter-terrorism laws could be unconstitutional. - http://www.abc.net.au/worldtoday/content/2005/s1490158.htm

Terror laws need scrutiny: Beazley
Melbourne Herald Sun, Australia - 25 October 2005
QUEENSLAND Premier Peter Beattie's concerns about the constitutionality of new terror laws proved the need for proper scrutiny by a Parliamentary committee... - http://www.heraldsun.news.com.au/common/story_page/0,5478,17029147%255E1702,00.html

Legal advice questions new terror laws
Sydney Morning Herald - 25 October 2005
Australia's legal chiefs will hold an urgent meeting after two state governments warned tough new anti-terror laws could breach the constitution. - http://www.smh.com.au/news/National/Legal-advice-questions-new-terror-laws/2005/10/25/1130006107033.html

Blog Views

Welcome to Australia, Guantanamo Bay Mach II!
Random Black Heart Glitter Moments
...to ensure new anti-terrorism laws are constitutional, Queensland Premier Peter Beattie says..." Anti-terror...: "Australians overwhelmingly endorse the anti-terrorism plan agreed by the Commonwealth, states... definitely don't say yes to terrorism. But it needs debate, consideration and proper work to make sure - http://randomblackheartglittermoments.blogspot.com/2005/10/welcome-to-australia-guantanamo-bay.html

two peas, no pod  Cristy C
So, according to the Guardian, Nepal's "King" has decided to take his madness another step further and ban any news from the radio that "causes hatred or disrespect" to the royal family, in addition to changing media ownership laws and further restricting access to foreign publications. Things in Nepal are getting pretty bad. I wonder, though, how much worse is this (at least on paper) to the new anti-terrorism laws in Australia? - http://nopod.blogspot.com/2005/10/sedition.html

Indonesia indifferent to Australian terror law...
DZD News: The latest on curren...
NEWS.com.au reports the Indonesian President was "enthusiastically receptive" to the offer of Australian teams advising Indonesia on counter-terrorism laws and institutional structures. However, other Indonesian politicians noted that Indonesia had successfully prosecuted and convicted more than 250 people for terrorism, while Australia has convicted one, Perth man Jack Roche. As such, they said Australia's offer of expert assistance could be seen as redundant. - http://duplexdude.typepad.com/news/2005/10/indonesia_indif.html

Here's some meaty journalism
God & Politics
Other Recent Articles by John Pilger - http://free-blog-site.com/sangtalkzone/archive/2005/10/18/84741.aspx

That’s Australian for Justice!
Pop Occulture
One of the craziest possible new laws of all time, and this time not from the US, but from Australia: Proposed legislation in Australia would make it a crime for one parent to tell the other... it a step further, they could just outlaw people altogether. Then we wouldn’t have terrorism - http://www.timboucher.com/journal/2005/10/24/australian-for-justice/

Threadbare Democacry
We do not need to be in Iraq. Think, Canada. Thnk, New Zealand. Or if you wish think, France, think, Germany.
And by extention we do not have to have the so-called "anti-terrorism" laws that call into question the continued existence of our status as a democracy. We may still be a democracy in a sense, since people still vote, but what kind of democracy are we becoming? - http://ian_westbrook.blogspot.com/2005/10/threadbare-democracy.html

Fiji Muslims Question Aussie Terrorism Proposal
Moreover Technologies - moreover...


A brief history of habeas corpus
BBC 9 March 2005
Habeas corpus is under attack, say critics of the government's anti-terror bill. But what is it and why is it so cherished?
Habeas corpus (ad subjiciendum) is Latin for "you may have the body" (subject to examination). It is a writ which requires a person detained by the authorities be brought before a court of law so that the legality of the detention may be examined. - http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/magazine/4329839.stm

This is about liberty…”
North Sea Diaries
This Bill affects every citizen of this country. With the fines that it can impose and its proposals for a national identity register, it reaches into every particular of identity” - Richard Shepherd http://www.north-sea.net/2005/10/19/this-is-about-liberty/


Terrorism seminar urges residents to stay alert
Allentown Morning Call, PA - 25 October 2005
State police identify possible targets and warning signs to help prevent attacks. Remain vigilant to prevent terrorism. - http://www.mcall.com/news/local/all-b1-5terrorismoct25,0,2627358.story?coll=all-newslocal-hed

Empowering Americans to Defeat Terrorism
"Terrorism Investments of the 50 States" is the first national ... Although Cuba is also correctly listed as a state-sponsor of terrorism by the US Department of State, relevant data for Cuba was not available for this study. ... http://smoothstone.blogspot.com/2005/10/empowering-americans-to-defeat.html


Counter-Terrorism Measures and Human Rights, Keys for ...
FIDH (Communiqués de presse), France -  24th/10/2005
September 11, 2001 terrorist attacks on the American soil marked a decisive turning point in the history of terrorist attacks as well as counter-terrorism measures and practices. The international community through the United Nations Security Council reacted to these attacks by adopting Resolution 1373 (2001) creating the Counter-Terrorism Committee (CTC) and imposing obligations on member States to raise national capacity to combat terrorism in all its forms. Following that resolution, States have started enacting specific counter-terrorism measures in their domestic law in a way incomparable to what had previously been done. http://www.fidh.org/article.php3?id_article=2784

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re: Anti-terrorism laws - links update #4

There should be a referenda on this matter. It will effectively take the issue out of the Courts hands and place it in the people's.

For a site that is promotes itself as believing in democracy for the people I am surprised this issue has not got more traction. Or does direct democracy only work some of the time here?

If the High Court does strike down these laws I would not be surprised to see this issue as a referendum choice at the next election. At that time there will be no doubts as to what the people truly want.

Exactly the democracy should work.

re: Anti-terrorism laws - links update #4

Damian Lataan, that is for the people to decide. Again we are not living in Cuba.

Just like with the Cuban leadership the people really do seem to scare you.

re: Anti-terrorism laws - links update #4

Jay White, there is nothing less democratic than a referendum where lies are the predominate feature of the reason for the referendum.

re: Anti-terrorism laws - links update #4

Michael de Angelos, don't be surprised if it is. These proposals may well not go past the High Court.

I think John Howard should have every confidence the proposals regarding terror laws will be supported. He would also I suspect have the support of the Labor party with any proposals.

As the Parliament and Court are ultimately there for and by the people, it may be time for the people to give both some direction in what they want their country to look like.

There is nothing more democratic than a referendum.

re: Anti-terrorism laws - links update #4

A referedum on something so important? That would be the day.

re: Anti-terrorism laws - links update #4

Jay White, I’m talking about real democracy. Not the pseudo-democracy that you’d like to see where Howard gets to lie to the Australian people and the Australian parliament – again – and where the dumb and gullible are once more taken for a ride as they have been these last few elections.

Like Hitler, Howard is trying to use ‘democracy’ to deny the people their democratic rights.

re: Anti-terrorism laws - links update #4

Damian Lataan, you sound as if your scared of a little democracy? Solves the problem of the High Court ever striking the laws down.

This, Damian Lataan is true democracy not the type practised in Cuba. I say let the people have their say.

re: Anti-terrorism laws - links update #4

I notice that Jay White is still carrying on about, ‘what the people truly want’ under the guise of what he calls ‘democracy’. He even suggests “…there should be a referenda on this matter”.

What utter nonsense. First, how on earth can there be a referendum on something that the vast majority of people know little or nothing about? And secondly, what lies would the government tell the voters this time round in order to scare the pants of the dumb and gullible? One has to wonder what lies ASIO were told to tell the Premiers and Chief Ministers to get them to initially agree to this anti-terrorist garbage in the first place.

A referendum on the matter?! Whatever next? These new laws are designed to diminish what little ‘democracy’ we have left – not enhance it.

re: Anti-terrorism laws - links update #4

According to this report in today’s SMH it seems our SAS are about to resume training the instructors that train Muslim extremists in Indonesia.

Downer is very much aware of Kopassus’ links with the extremist organisation known as Lasker Jihad and its links with atrocities committed throughout Indonesian territories over the years, yet is still going forward with plans to allow Kopassus to train in Australia with the SAS.

Just one month after the Bali bombings of 12 October 2002, Downer was on his feet telling the House: “We have made no decision to renew links with Kopassus”. That was in November 2002. Within three months the decision was quietly made to renew links with Kopassus anyway.

Kopassus is an organisation that has maintained links with extremist organisations for many years, including with JI, though, naturally, Downer denies this part of Kopassus’ connections (adding the rider; ‘as far as we know’). He also says that the government only works with those elements of Kopassus that are not tainted with connections to atrocities or connections with Islamic extremist organisations. But how would one know who is and who isn’t?

If the intelligence to and fro between Indonesia and Australia is so good that we know who is and isn’t involved with atrocities and with Islamic extremists within Kopassus, why didn’t we get any warnings about the Bali bombings? And, if we did, why weren’t those warnings passed on to Australian travellers? The Americans got the warnings. They also passed them on to US travellers.

How come Downer didn’t?

Moving on to other developments, I wonder when Howard is going to come clean with the Australian people about what his intentions are with regard to the up-coming war with Iran and/or Syria? So far not a peep. There will need to be war pretty soon because Dick Cheney’s going to need something really big to distract the world’s attention away from the trouble he’s going to be in next week judging by the way things are going in the US at the moment.

re: Anti-terrorism laws - links update #4

This http://www.smh.com.au/news/world/two-thousand-and-counting/2005/10/26/1130302840451.html#
article in yesterday’s SMH by Paul McGeough puts paid to the right-wingers ludicrous fantasy that the Coalition of the Killing are welcome in Iraq.

It’s patently clear that it is time to leave Iraq.

re: Anti-terrorism laws - links update #4

Jay White. First, you keep talking about Cuba and I’m wondering what exactly Cuba has to do with ‘democracy’ in Australia. Secondly, democracy can only function when there is complete freedom of speech and complete openness and honesty from the government. A democracy cannot be run based on lies. When there are lies there will always be dumb and gullible people who will believe them. Hence no democracy.

You suggest that the ‘people scare’ me. When they’re as dumb and as gullible as many Australians seems to be, based on the fact that they seem to get sucked in every time by Howard’s lies, then yes, they are a bit of a worry. Thankfully they are in a minority – just – but we still have to cater for those that vote for Howard not so much because they are dumb and gullible but because they are, like Howard, racists or, like Howard, are happy to see the underclasses suffer even more under his outrageous pro-corporatist policies and philosophy.

Howard is a liar and a war criminal. The quicker the Australian people wake up to it the better for Australia. We can then begin to regain our dignity in the eyes of the rest of the world.

re: Anti-terrorism laws - links update #4

Jay White, my contempt is for the liar Howard and those that are dumb enough and gullible enough to vote for him. Howard is a proven liar and a war criminal. I have nothing but contempt for those that support him.

re: Anti-terrorism laws - links update #4

Damian Lataan Your contempt for the knowledge, ideas and sense of the voter at the ballot box is one of the reasons why they don't listen to you, or people who mirror what you say, Damien. For while you deride them, they ignore you. Who wins?

Somehow it seems that it is the people who get what they want (or at least they don't get who they don't want) and you get another period rambling about elected tyrants and generally being annoyed that a voting majority disagree with what you say.

Oh well.

re: Anti-terrorism laws - links update #4

A new meme (borrowing a little from earlier posts).

Why the architects of the terror bill will be guilty of treason:

Both detractors and supporters of PM Howard agree upon one thing; he is at least the devil we know. That was the undisputable premise upon which this government was returned at the last election. Business as usual, from the devil we know.

But no PM, government or party lasts forever - they all must pass.

Who or what will follow? Who or what will inherit this blank cheque, this blunt instrument, this weapon fit for a fuhrer?

We are resigned to handing the treasury keys to successive governments, for better or worse. But this... this is different.

This mob are going to leave the farm-gate open when they go. The key will be in the ignition. The ute door will be unlocked. We will be as sheep.

I, who have five grandchildren to leave this sorry state of affairs to, wish to point out that this is no less than an act of treason perpetrated upon the ordinary people of Australia. Treason against those who will inherit this country. Treason against my grandkids.

We'll take our chances with the "bogey man", thankyou very much ... After all, he is YOUR nightmare.

I warned you not to eat that Iraqi cheese!

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