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Israelis to shun bid for peace

Sol Salbe writes:

John Lyons is not the first observer to note that has no intention of resuming peace talks with the Palestinian Authority in the near future. But his observations are newsworthy precisely because his comments were published in the Australian – Murdoch’s flagship in Australia which is known for its strongly pro-Israeli stance. Had these comments been published somewhere else then, the hue and cry from certain quarters would have been unbearable.

Still, it is nice to read that “Israel is now imposing conditions on any talks, including that the Palestinian Authority recognise Israel as a Jewish state, that the right of return of Palestinians to what is now Israel is not an issue and that the status of Jerusalem - which both Israelis and Palestinians claim as their capital - is not negotiable.”

The article below touch on another matter upon which the paper is again unusually honest:

“Mr Obama yesterday held his first meeting with US Jewish leaders - a meeting that marked a possible changing of the guard of Jewish leadership in the US.

“Groups which under George W. Bush enjoyed good access to the White House - including the Lubavitch movement and the Zionist Organisation of America - were not included on the keenly contested list, while more liberal groups such as Americans for Peace Now and the newly formed J Street Lobby met Mr Obama.” The Jewish Telegraphic Agency listed all 16 guests representing 14 organisations and the change was rather stark. What was even more interesting was the outcome in which the JTA reported At White House, U.S. Jews offer little resistance to Obama policy on settlements.

In his Tikun Olam blog Richard Silverstein noted that Barack Obama said that his settlement freeze policy was ultimately “good for Israel.” Silverstein Continued: When it came time to take questions, the most hostile ones came from Malcolm Hoenlein, resident nyetnik of the Conference of Presidents. Here’s how the N.Y. Times described the encounter:

…Some of the toughest questioning of Mr. Obama came from Malcolm Hoenlein, executive vice chairman of the Conference of Presidents of Major American Jewish Organizations…Mr. Hoenlein told the president that diplomatic progress in the Middle East has traditionally occurred when there is “no light” between the positions of the United States and Israel. But Mr. Obama pushed back, citing the administration of his predecessor, George W. Bush.

“He said, ‘I disagree,’ ‘’ said Marla Gilson, director of the Washington action office of Hadassah, the women’s Zionist organization. “He said, ‘For eight years, there was no light between the United States and Israel, and nothing got accomplished.’

Silverstein continued: “For far too long Hoenlein’s narischkeit [foolishness, nonsense]has passed for commonly accepted pro-Israel wisdom in our community. Finally, finally a president is pushing back. Malcolm Hoenlein no longer owns the discourse.”

One only need to note that the JTA report of the Orthodox Union being concerned at Obama even-handedness to realise that the Israel/Palestine is unlikely be seen in the same old way again.

Israelis to shun bid for peace
by
John Lyons, Middle East correspondent  July 15, 2009

Israel has given its strongest signal to date that it has no intention of resuming peace talks with the Palestinian Authority in the near future as US President Barack Obama told Jewish leaders in Washington that Israel needs "to engage in serious self-reflection".

In comments certain to be met with concern in the US, Israeli Foreign Minister Avigdor Lieberman yesterday said the legitimacy of the leader of the Palestinian Authority, Mahmoud Abbas - the man with whom any negotiations would be held - was "doubtful".

Referring to Mr Abbas's Palestinian name, Abu Mazen, Mr Lieberman said: "The more Abu Mazen's authority and legitimacy decline, the more he increases his demands and the more rigid he becomes in his attitude."

He said that while Israel signed the Oslo accords 16 years ago with an administration that represented all Palestinians, "today you have Fatah-land in Judea and Samaria and Hamastan in Gaza".

Mr Lieberman also dismissed criticism of him by French President Nicolas Sarkozy to Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu. Mr Sarkozy criticised Mr Netanyahu for appointing Mr Lieberman as Foreign Minister, given Mr Lieberman's comments towards Arabs in Israel, which his critics say are racist.

Mr Lieberman said he regarded such comments by Mr Sarkozy as "a compliment".

His attack on Mr Abbas's legitimacy adds to the view that Israel is not intending to resume talks with Palestinians in the near future.

After the meeting in Washington between Mr Netanyahu and Mr Obama earlier this year, Mr Netanyahu suggested he would resume talks with Palestinians immediately and without preconditions.

But Israel is now imposing conditions on any talks, including that the Palestinian Authority recognise Israel as a Jewish state, that the right of return of Palestinians to what is now Israel is not an issue and that the status of Jerusalem - which both Israelis and Palestinians claim as their capital - is not negotiable.

Mr Obama yesterday held his first meeting with US Jewish leaders - a meeting that marked a possible changing of the guard of Jewish leadership in the US.

Groups which under George W. Bush enjoyed good access to the White House - including the Lubavitch movement and the Zionist Organisation of America - were not included on the keenly contested list, while more liberal groups such as Americans for Peace Now and the newly formed J Street Lobby met Mr Obama.

The umbrella lobby group the American Israel Public Affairs Committee retained a position on the list for the White House meeting.

The Israeli government has been caught by surprise by the strength of calls by Mr Obama and the US Secretary of State Hillary Clinton for Israel to halt settlement activity.

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So who cares Eliot?

The photo was taken 68 years ago when the man was already in exile from Palestine.

 Iit was Germany who slaughtered millions of jewish refugees, not the Palestinians, yet you are prepared to not only blame the Palestinians but allow them to be abused, murdered, bombed and blasted to bits over something as trivial as a meeting with Hitler in 1941.

You need to get a grip on reality. 

Four years is a long time in Middle Eastern politics, clearly

Marilyn Shepherd: "So who cares Eliot?"

Well, I thought you cared, Marilyn. After all, you brought the topic up in the first place.

You've seemed to care a lot (albeit rather selectively) about what was happening in 1945 and 1948.

It's odd that so suddenly you'd lose interest completely in what was happening in 1941.

"The photo was taken 68 years ago when the man was already in exile from Palestine."

Exiled? Was that for murdering Jews?

Haj Amin al-Husseini was in so many respects the moral and political forerunner to today's Islamists like Khalid Mishal, so I thought you'd be delighted to hear about him.

Utter balderdash

He didn't kill anyone.   He was not trying to kill Jews, just to keep them out of Palestine.

As was the rest of the world.

 

We salute you

Marilyn Shepherd: "He was not trying to kill Jews, just to keep them out of Palestine."

See below, Marilyn:

 "...Haj Amin al-Husseini] led a number of violent campaigns against Jewish immigrants."

His Hamas descendants still give Nazi salutes to this day. See this picture. See Hamas supporters giving Nazi salutes in this video.

Chatting with Hitler

For those genuinely interested in learning about it, Simon Ball's book The Bitter Sea: the Struggle for Mastery in the Mediterranean 1935–1949 gives a concise account of Haj Amin al-Husseini's meeting with Hitler and his (Husseini's) plans for an anti-Jewish and anti-British pan-Arabic alliance with the Nazi state.

Hitler found the idea attractive, but the problem was that his other allies, Mussolini and Franco had vital interests of their own to protect in North Africa and these conflicted with Husseini's.

Simon Ball points out that Husseini hated only one thing more than the British who administered the Palestinian mandate, and that was Jews.

Nothing new under the Mediterranean sun, really.

So who the hell cares?

He didn't achieve anything did he?

And Bush's grand daddy, the Queen Mother and other luminaries thought Hitler was a lovely chappie as they did their various business deals with him and rearmed him over many years.

You need to stop whining about the bloody minor transgressions of bit players and look at today, Eliot.

Mufti led a number of violent campaigns

Marilyn Shepherd: "Sending around pictures of the dead former mufti of Jerusalem who had one meeting with Hitler in 1941 as an excuse to steal more land in Palestine."

Here's what actually happened...

Israel's firebrand foreign minister has ordered that his country's embassies and consulates around the world display a photograph of Adolf Hitler [meeting] with a Palestinian cleric ."...

"At the time the Mufti [the Grand Mufti of Jerusalem, Haj Amin al-Husseini] led a number of violent campaigns against Jewish immigrants in what was then British-ruled Palestine, and he unsuccessfully sought Hitler's support for Arab independence and against Israel's creation.

The Mufti was the owner of a building in Arab East Jerusalem.

The site is now the centre of a dispute between Israel and the US, which is demanding a halt to plans to convert it into "a Jewish apartment block".

They shouldn't make it into an apartment block.

They should make it the headquarters of the International Solidarity Group. And name it the Khalid Mishal Peace Centre or something, hey Marilyn?

Bibi's latest scam

Sending around pictures of the dead former mufti of Jerusalem who had one meeting with Hitler in 1941 as an excuse to steal more land in Palestine.

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